85 200x lets begin

[jenndnn3]

I am starting on this, and want to explore a few things, before I decide what to do.

A couple of issues I want to address, The kicker starter. Frankly, I want to beef this area up. Is there a better spring? Where is it? Better kicker gears? Next I want to incorporate decompresion into this engine. Lets discuss those options. I was thinking off the handle bars, push button style.

Performance, I was thinking powroll's crank. Mid cam, then possible piston options. Not sure which one here yet, I have not decided. I have heard that one person has incorporated the 6th gear in this, would love to hear about that. And exactly if anything it added. (200xbasket hint hint).

Lets stick to these, If any of you have anything related to this, I would like to hear about it. I really do not want to discuss suspension yet, I will fix that when I need to. I am mostly after bottom end info right now but realize you need to adjust each to accomadate topend or each other. (sorry realize weird way to say this). I am not looking for cheap fixes here. I am looking for the best. Doesnt matter if its cheap or expensive. I will be useing Powroll as my primary performance unless, someone can prove a better option. Prove is a good key word here.

I have at my disposal right now an xr and 2 200x engines. Have to double check year on xr.

I know this question will come up, "What do you want to achieve?" The fastest, quickest, most reliable 200x. Without sacrifycing the lowend. A good overall beef, does this make sense.

[ridetrikes250R]

wat i would do is put a 12:1 compression piston a mild cam and replace anything that needs to be in the engine, you can make very fast fourstrokes with out needing to stroke them if u do go witht the powroll stroker, but i wouldnt stroke it and i wouldnt do a 6th gear mod 5spd are good but its all up to u for reilablity i would go 11:1 compression mild cam and make sure that the engine has been rebuilt with everything tha needs replacing (bearings all that) then finish it off with a nice DG Xcelerator exhaust take the lid off of the air box run a k/n filter and jet proberly and it would be a quick bike
thats basically wat i did to my 185s exhaust,cam,piston,jettin
adam

[Glenn]

Keep in mind that a higher compresison piston will make the machine harder to kick over.

There's an interesting thread over on the Atvconnection.com forums regarding using an XR200R carb along with an older XR200 intake manifold. There's currently some debate regarding exactly what XR manifold will fit and keep the carb at the stock angle.

[Kryten]

They are probably referring to article "Top 200X Mods" which is actually posted on this website. I have tried this myself. The article refers to using the '80-'84 XR200 intake with a XR200R carb. Yes, the intake will mate to the carb perfectly, and yes the intake will mate to the head correctly. The PROBLEM however is the angle. It will not work as is. Now I'm sure with alot of machining to the intake it could be repositioned to work at the correct angle. The XR200R carb will mate to the stock intake, but it's not perfect and probably will take away any gains from the bigger carb. The article talks about doing these mods to a 200X engine for a quad chassis so that's why the certain carb and intake combo. Hope that helps.

[ladano]

As far as the piston, weisco has proven itself over and over. Compression, becomes a reliability with other mods for compensation. Cam: web cams are probably the best out there, also they have 3 different stages of set-ups. Each one has options on valves, springs, and retainers from mild to wild. Check thier site. Also you need a core, They are picly about that so its best to pay the core charge.

[jenndnn3]

Yes Glenn that is why I want decompression. I believe I am keeping stock carb.

[badASS4man]

While your replacing teh valves it wouldnt hurt to put a nice port and polish job on the head too. $80-100 well spent for your build up.

Good Luck with the build :headbang:

[Mr. Richard]

I believe I am keeping stock carb.

then build it stock ,,, cause that is the biggest bottle neck on a 200x,,, :rolleyes:

[jenndnn3]

LOL sure thing,,,

Someone once told me a trick I plan on useing..

Port and polish absolutly! Just gotta find the right shop.

[tdup]

I will check tomorrow and see which intake number I have on my bike.

My 26mm carb fits perfect to my air box intake. With a little stretching I am even using the stock intake tube with no mods.

I have an 83 200x converted to 6 speed, 26mm carb,uni filter, xr intake, ported head, 10.25 to 1 wisco piston, DG krome pipe and an xr cam. Since I now have a midrange running motor instead of a stock 200x motor I run an 11 tooth front sprocket to allow me to billy goat around when needed. With the six speed I still have a nice top speed even with the 11 tooth front.

My bike has at least as much slow speed power as a stock geared stock 200x. But with this set up I will absolutly blow the plastic off of a stock 200x once I hit midrange. And yes it is definetly enough to feel to diffence.

Over time my bike has ran with all stock every thing then converted piece at a time to check the diffent out comes to see what part make the most improvements. Here is my take on the performance scale most improvement being 1 and working down.

1 - six speed gear box. I love it.
2 - 26 mm carb . The single largest bang for the buck. Any one telling you it wont help is WRONG. Very noticable change from top to bottom.
3- Mild port work, Free flowing exaust. The exaust ports are very restrictive on the 200 heads. To get hardly any gain other than sound from an aftermarket exaust the head will need at least a mild port job. I Dont recommend a heavily ported head unless you are going to use a top end aftermarket race cam.
4- 10.25 to 1 piston I like pump gas
5 - xr cam- great lower mid range to mid range cam.

This is basically a forward kick xr200 motor with a mild port job and a pipe stuck on an atc chassic. The xr200 or 200x motor in this state should last a very long time.

[JxxxOxxxE]

Originally posted by tdup


I have an 83 200x converted to 6 speed.....



1 - six speed gear box. I love it.



How did you put a 6 speed in there? I would love to have that in my 85'

[jenndnn3]

Thank you tdup just what I needed. Where or which year did you steal the 6 gears from? Your setup is almost to level I want except I plan on useing powroll. I want their crank. Was the 26mm a special order or also swiped?

[Glenn]

Jenn,
I'm 99% sure you can order an XR200R 26mm carb from your dealer or Service Honda. I priced one from Service Honda about a month or so and it was about $140...less shipping. Not too bad for a brand new carb.

tdup,
Please let us know what intake you're using for that 26mm carb. We're having a heck of a time finding a 26mm intake that will make up with the 26mm carb and keep it from hitting the frame. Those Honda engineers didn't give us a lot of room to work with on the 200X frame.

[tdup]

I wish I new which year on the intake. All I can find on it is Ka2 and no numbers. The next time I pull off the tank I will inspect it very close for numbers. The Carb is the xr carb. I would get the new one for $140 instead of kitting an old one. I have another XR Bottom end coming in. I will try to take lots of pics and develop a tech page for the 6 speed converstion. It is really a pretty simple conversion if you arent afraid to split your cases. My gear set is out of an 83 xr my new bottom end coming in is an 82.

[ATCnut]

KA2 is probably the Honda code. My table says KA2 = 81 - 83 XR200R

[xcracer160]

to get the 6 speed tranny us ethe gears from anxr200 and for the head xl 185 this head already has a decopression lever in it already.

[ladano]

This sounds good since my cases are already split.

[jenndnn3]

Tdup I really appreciate your responses. As I tear in I am sure I will have more questions. You just sealed the 6th gear question. I am very excited about this project.

My xr engine has a decompression on it, I believe, but it looks automatic. I want to make it manual.

[Tyler 54]

Jenn if you want a manual Decompression, just buy a Setup off a newer dirtbike, You may have to search for one that connects to your head but it shouldnt be hard. WE turned a 350X into a mnual decompression last year, just got a cable!

[Glenn]

Originally posted by tdup
I wish I new which year on the intake. All I can find on it is Ka2 and no numbers. The next time I pull off the tank I will inspect it very close for numbers. The Carb is the xr carb. I would get the new one for $140 instead of kitting an old one. I have another XR Bottom end coming in. I will try to take lots of pics and develop a tech page for the 6 speed converstion. It is really a pretty simple conversion if you arent afraid to split your cases. My gear set is out of an 83 xr my new bottom end coming in is an 82.

Very cool! Keep us posted! :headbang:

[tdup]

Make sure the cam cover has the style of decompression lever you want. You can interchange "some of the levers only" to get the type you want. but all levers will not interchange. there are 2 types of rockers and lever acturator pins. They must match. If you put the wrong type in your exaust valve cannot fully close because the actuator pin will not let the valve close.

A friend of mine has a 2004 350 honda utility. He has been giving my a lot of grief about how dangerous ATC are. He came out to the house to go riding today and here are some out comes. I cant wait to see him at work tomorrow.

4wheeler turned overbackward on a hill climb While I was LMAO waiting at the top of the hill.

4wheeler had two other close calls while "trying" to keep up with me in the woods. ATC no close calls.

4wheeler gets chewed up and spit out in a drag race.

4wheeler gets outrun Bad, in a open area by My 22 year old "Dangerous ATC" I shifted into 6th and gave him the finger as I went by. " his speedo was saying 54"

4wheeler rider still talks smack going home. LOL with his tale tucked.

[jenndnn3]

Thank you for the bit of info. SO I need one that is already setup for manual, is basically what you are saying.

Love the story!

After chatting with hubby he is swinging to just 5 gears, he believes it will keep it more torquy.

[ladano]

Jenn, you wanna get rid of the xr tranny?

[jenndnn3]

Not until I know what all parts I need. I parts horded for a while, trying to keep this relatively cheap. Once it is done, I will have a huge 200x parts sale.

[ladano]

Thought I'd ask, getting my crank back this week. Figured while its still apart, 6 speeds would be nice.

[jenndnn3]

Have you looked into just buying the gearing from honda? Maybe easier then finding a whole motor? Not neccassarily cheaper tho, I am sure. I just got extremely lucky on my engine. And I still have to double check its compatability. The biggest problem I have right now is time. Now the old man wants me to get the R painted.:doh: The tinker crap always gets pushed back for the daily riders.,, Tho I am very seriously considering just sending an engine to Powroll and saying HAVE FUN!! I am still waiting to hear on the kickstarter issue as well. Once I have that in my hands, its a go from there.

[ladano]

I think I'm just going to put it back together. Its been about 6mths since I tore it down and now I'm getting antsee to hit the dunes.

[haywood71]

The intake used by tdup is from a 81-83 XR200R part number 16210-KA2-000 $21.49 from SERVICE HONDA if still available.


I used a 1990 XR200R intake on mine with no problems, part number 16210-KT0-000 $20.30 from SERVICE HONDA if still available.


I had also tried this which Kryten posted earlier in this thread


They are probably referring to article "Top 200X Mods" which is actually posted on this website. I have tried this myself. The article refers to using the '80-'84 XR200 intake with a XR200R carb. Yes, the intake will mate to the carb perfectly, and yes the intake will mate to the head correctly. The PROBLEM however is the angle. It will not work as is. Now I'm sure with alot of machining to the intake it could be repositioned to work at the correct angle. The XR200R carb will mate to the stock intake, but it's not perfect and probably will take away any gains from the bigger carb. The article talks about doing these mods to a 200X engine for a quad chassis so that's why the certain carb and intake combo. Hope that helps.

And that intake ('80-'84 XR200 non-R) will not work.

Jeff

[Glenn]

Here's a random though. Think boring a stock 200X intake out 2mm would work? If so, you'd already have the correct angle.....

[ladano]

It would probably be pretty thin. $20 sounds alot easer.

[haywood71]

Hey Glenn

haywoodjalikme from the atv connection board, you been in the discussions about this on their boards with myself and KNOWSALOT.

I don't know if I posted this on there when we were talkin' intakes but I did at on time take the stock 200X intake and hog it out with the die grinder and smooth it with a brake hone. It worked fairly well but the alignment of the intake and carb bothered me since the XR carb port and mount holes are on center and the stock 200X intake port and mounting studs are not on center so when bolted together you can see the oring from the carb above the edge of the intake.

I just put some extra silicone on top for peace of mind and the engine ran fine but I just didn't like the way it looked and the chance it would suck some dirt in scared me with my new engine and thats why I changed to the matching '90 Xr200r intake that was meant for the carb.

As far as milling the xr200 non-r intake enough for it to work at the right angle, I don't think there is enough material to work with.

Jeff

[Glenn]

Ah, thanks for the update Jeff!

Geez, those Honda engineers certainly didn't make this easy!

I wonder if we could fine an intake that would work, then have it reproduced? I know there are some places that make larger quad intake manifolds. They must have the tooling to duplicate and old XR manifold.

[jenndnn3]

I just found out I have an 87 xr engine. So we shall see.....

ALSO The kicker fix is a no go. completely gone, for 85's. So looking int other avenues as well.

[Glenn]

Jenn,
I coudl have sworn someone on 3ww mentioned someting about grinding some part of the kicker that would make it less prone to slipping. I "think" the person was talking about the holder that contacts the gears. You may want to ask over there.

[bones200x]

you say XR carb. What year? Can you still get it? $140. Thanks.

[Glenn]

I "think" any late model XR200R carb will work. I checked the part number on servicehonda.com and it was $140. I think I checked the part number from a 2001 or 2002 XR200R.

[jenndnn3]

Tdup, I was researching 3ww, and saw the conversion on the xr to forward kick. Can you get into more detials on this. This question is also asked in general tech as well. It would seem to me that the "smarter" conversion would be to just use the xr engine, adding the forward kick. I have test ran the bolt up looks to be a good fit. The xr engine I have has decompresion. Another requirement I really desire. Can you feed me more info or your thoughts? Thx Jen